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Post by boesucks on Dec 22, 2016 13:54:26 GMT -5
Just to clarify two points from oldtimer1 response. I brought up Debbie Gregory because in my opinion Pearman's personnel hiring choices have been questionable, but Debbie might be her best one. The only issue with Debbie was with talking with her was she had one way, the Manhattan way. Every response was "Well that's not how we did it at Manhattan and we are not going to do that here" and I really did not think that Saint Peter's should be trying to do it the Manhattan way because they are not the gold standard in the MAAC (no offense to any Manhattan fans). If she wanted to compare us to Monmouth or an Iona that would be different because I believe that you want to work toward doing things the best way and not just three spots ahead. Debbie is also a great follower so when she calls to tell you that Pearman resigned she is going to tell you want the boss wants you to know, which may not be the truth.
Katie was brought into the discussion by oldtimer1 as a possible interim AD candidate so I just wanted to let the group no about some of her negative qualities. She is a very hard worker and will do her best for whoever is in charge, but when a new person comes in she changes into whatever she thinks the new AD wants her to be. That is why if you talk to Quinlan, Jacobson, Pearman and probably Bryngil when he is down each of them will talk about how much of an MVP she was while they were there. However, I talked to Jacobson after Pearman was there for a while and he expressed his displeasure and disappointment for how she changed as a person under Pearman. Katie is obviously a great follower and does a great job, but not sure that she could be a good leader.
Again I was not trying to offend anyone with bringing up these two people.
Thanks for the clarification on the money peacockpride. I heard that the provost was going to give Athletics $200,000 to help with the budget since they were pretty much over that amount every year, but Pearman elected to use the money for personnel additions instead. Again I could have been wrong with that information so I am happy for the new information.
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Post by oldtimer1 on Dec 22, 2016 14:22:46 GMT -5
Kati hasn't changed as a nice and competitent person one bit. Doubt if she had many , if any, interactions with Jim once his job was completed. So how could he have expressed displeasure and disappointment? Jim's a great guy and I thought that he would have made a good AD but obviously after being exposed to the politics wanted no part of the job. Jim was not a big Boe fan, in fact, directly the opposite. But it shows that we can respect others on both sides of the issue.
No, I don't believe that Kati would be an ideal AD but to label her a follower and not a leader is inaccurate. Doubt if it would ever happen anyway.
Did we not need additional personel. We have a staff smaller than most high schools! Our facilities position was open for years not to mention some of the other one's she filled. Made us almost look like a Department. Good job in that.
And no...Debbie did not call me to just to tell me that Boe had resigned. She asked if I could be over at school because EC called a meeting of all those available to meet with him and Dave Bryngil in the Peacock Cafe at 3PM. Couldn't make it so I asked Debbie what was going on. It's then that she told me that Boe had resigned. So let's get our stories straight. What happened, I'm sure that Debbie had no idea because when I asked her about Boe where Boe was, I was told that she had already left Campus....that fast!
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Post by figgyprez on Dec 22, 2016 14:24:01 GMT -5
Too much here reads like a rock song- you know rumor has it- What I will say is that Boe injected more life into the bball program than has occurred in many years. She also recognized that the few ardent supporters needed to be used as a base for future expansion not like the deer above the fireplace act of Quinlan. She wanted excellence and clearly broke some eggs to make the omelet. With her dismissal and our budget issues I can only imagine the lap dog type of candidates who will be applying for the opening. No ambitious self respecting budding administrator would want it.
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Post by oldtimer1 on Dec 22, 2016 16:15:53 GMT -5
I just read the boesucks post in it's entirity. I skipped over a lot of it to concentrate on the comments made about Debbie and Kati. Just reading it I saw the inaccurate " guesses" made about me. Again, wanted to set the record straight.
First, I had no "succession plan" or desire to leave before Boe arrived. Never even crossed my mind. Then last Spring, 9 months into Boe's tenure my Captain, best player and MAAC Champion was to graduate> I've always enjoyed a close relationship with my playes...attend their weddings and write countless letters of recommendation. Well, Nick Dilio, one of my best ever was thinking about making Golf a career. I wasn't really ready to pack it in so it caused me a dilemna. I suggested to Nick why not try coaching. Did this for him but really was not ready to retire.
All this took place way afte Boe was hired. Knowing that Nick needed some mentoring as running a Program is more work than most can imagine, I approached Boe. Contrary to what is posted above, Boe asked me not to leave. Nor did I want to...a dilemna! Well we worked things out and got approval from Dr. O'Sullivan. I was to become Director of Golf ( as Fairfield, Monmouth and some other schools have ) and Nick Head Golf Coach. I feel very good about the whole thing, especially for Nick.
So while I appreciate the initial compliment above it is still inaccurate and full of conjecture. That's how I read the entire post. Some of it factually correct but just as much speculation and conjecture. Bottom line...Boe indeed was a lighting rod but her heart was in the right place, always wanted the best for Athletics. How could anyone not respect that?
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Post by spusoccerplayer on Dec 22, 2016 19:00:37 GMT -5
For what it is worth, here is a copy of the agenda from that December 14th meeting which probably led to the resignation of Boe Pearman yesterday. Check out item #5 to get your blood boiling.
How you could include "budget needs to be competitive" and talk about the crummy fields we play on, while they intend to cut us by 7% or more.. What a joke. None of the kids here will be able to afford to go to this school if it gets changed to D3, so good luck with that.
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Post by spusoccerplayer on Dec 22, 2016 19:26:07 GMT -5
To show you how petty the higher ups are...there was a write up posted on the website a week ago about Boe being honored when the women's team played at Maryland. To be honest, at the time I didn't really see the need to post this on the website as it was basically Boe being on the video board and a one paragraph write up on her time at Maryland - more a recognition than an honor. That article has been removed from the website, although it still comes up if you Google search it. Just takes you to a broken link if you click on it. Disgraceful... Part of me thinks that this was planned for some time. We all know how slowly things move at SP. In order to have an interim AD in place less than 24 hours after Boe left tells me someone had a heads up it was coming. Again, no insider knowledge, but just putting the pieces together. Newfan- I doubt that this will have any effect on athletes transferring. Most student athletes have little day to day interaction with an AD as opposed to if a coach left. If you're an athlete at SP, it is probably very evident that the school doesn't prioritize athletics. Most have friends and former teammates that play for other schools - they know what their friends have and SP doesn't. Boe leaving doesn't really change much in that regard in the short term. As long time fans, we recognize the changes that she made in a short time, but in the big picture they are a very small percentage of what needs to be done to catch us up in a lot of areas. I disagree with the ending, about transferring. This will absolutely make kids question it, especially when that 7%+ cut rumor/truth/etc gets spread throughout the athletes. If they're not ignorant, which a lot aren't, they will see that were on the path to get treated even worse. Ask any kid at the school if they feel like D1 athletes, w/ exception to M&W Bball, the answer would be the same.. The school has the athletes playing in dangerous conditions (still don't understand why the other MAAC schools don't refuse to play in Jersey City..), run down facilities, and then sends us to these other schools to see Universities who actually care about their athletes.. Taking more money away will just amplify the bad.
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Post by peacockpride on Dec 22, 2016 21:39:44 GMT -5
To show you how petty the higher ups are...there was a write up posted on the website a week ago about Boe being honored when the women's team played at Maryland. To be honest, at the time I didn't really see the need to post this on the website as it was basically Boe being on the video board and a one paragraph write up on her time at Maryland - more a recognition than an honor. That article has been removed from the website, although it still comes up if you Google search it. Just takes you to a broken link if you click on it. Disgraceful... Part of me thinks that this was planned for some time. We all know how slowly things move at SP. In order to have an interim AD in place less than 24 hours after Boe left tells me someone had a heads up it was coming. Again, no insider knowledge, but just putting the pieces together. Newfan- I doubt that this will have any effect on athletes transferring. Most student athletes have little day to day interaction with an AD as opposed to if a coach left. If you're an athlete at SP, it is probably very evident that the school doesn't prioritize athletics. Most have friends and former teammates that play for other schools - they know what their friends have and SP doesn't. Boe leaving doesn't really change much in that regard in the short term. As long time fans, we recognize the changes that she made in a short time, but in the big picture they are a very small percentage of what needs to be done to catch us up in a lot of areas. I disagree with the ending, about transferring. This will absolutely make kids question it, especially when that 7%+ cut rumor/truth/etc gets spread throughout the athletes. If they're not ignorant, which a lot aren't, they will see that were on the path to get treated even worse. Ask any kid at the school if they feel like D1 athletes, w/ exception to M&W Bball, the answer would be the same.. The school has the athletes playing in dangerous conditions (still don't understand why the other MAAC schools don't refuse to play in Jersey City..), run down facilities, and then sends us to these other schools to see Universities who actually care about their athletes.. Taking more money away will just amplify the bad. I'm assuming from your screen name that you are a current or former athlete. Weren't you aware of the poor facilities, field conditions, etc of SP compared to other schools when you decide to enroll? 7%, when spread over 19 programs and the general athletic operating budget would only result in a few thousands dollars for each program. Significant given how little the school has, but probably will not be felt that much by the individual teams.
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Post by oldtimer1 on Dec 22, 2016 22:44:08 GMT -5
According to what I posted previously about the Coach's meeting both Boe and Debbie have already complied within a few thousand dollars. The problem, of course, as peacock pride knows, that our current funding is totally rediculous. Can't tell anyone how inadequate my current budget is. Probably the same for other sports.
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Post by oldtimer1 on Dec 23, 2016 0:24:14 GMT -5
Thought I was done with this but within the hour I just received an e mail addressed to all individuals ( administrators, staff coach's etc. ) involved in athletics. It was a very long e mail from Dave Bryngil. Cutting to the chase
1) It was a very long and well written e mail outling a lot of items to be accomplished. Although extremely well written it reminded me that Dave has so many other responsibilities outside of athletics that I sort of feel sorry for him. Those responsibilities were highlighted in my mind with Dave stating that he would be operating out of his office in the MacMahon Center and not in the Athletic Offices
2) What immediately caught my eye however was the opening statement that Athletics will return to being placed under the umbrella of the Offices of Student Life and Development and leadership of Dr. Anthony Skevakis. Anthony, in my view , is a young, good and energetic guy who has moved up the ladder fairly rapidly and, I think, well deserved.
However, I wonder if this is a demotion of Athletics. Don't really know because I've tried to remove myself from the politics of this all. What I do know is that Boe originally reported directly to our Provost when previously she reported to Carla Thorp. My gut feeling was that Boe was successful in gaining more recognition for Athletics by having her report directly to Dr, O'Sullivan. Now as Dave Bryngil's e mail stated Athletics is back under Student Life and Development. A reduction in our status?? Don't know
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Post by peacockpride on Dec 23, 2016 6:58:49 GMT -5
IMO, the important part of the "chain of command" is not who the AD's direct report is. The important part is that the AD has direct access to Cornacchia when he/she needs it. This was something Elliot changed early in his tenure. It's not really relevant who the AD reports to on day to day operations, but when something needs to get done, the AD needs to be able to get the ear of the President.
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Post by spusoccerplayer on Dec 23, 2016 8:56:25 GMT -5
I disagree with the ending, about transferring. This will absolutely make kids question it, especially when that 7%+ cut rumor/truth/etc gets spread throughout the athletes. If they're not ignorant, which a lot aren't, they will see that were on the path to get treated even worse. Ask any kid at the school if they feel like D1 athletes, w/ exception to M&W Bball, the answer would be the same.. The school has the athletes playing in dangerous conditions (still don't understand why the other MAAC schools don't refuse to play in Jersey City..), run down facilities, and then sends us to these other schools to see Universities who actually care about their athletes.. Taking more money away will just amplify the bad. I'm assuming from your screen name that you are a current or former athlete. Weren't you aware of the poor facilities, field conditions, etc of SP compared to other schools when you decide to enroll? 7%, when spread over 19 programs and the general athletic operating budget would only result in a few thousands dollars for each program. Significant given how little the school has, but probably will not be felt that much by the individual teams. Yes, Pride, we were aware of bad facilities. We all get fed the idea of making a change, helping the program, etc, and against contrary belief, a lot of us want to. But when the worse gets worse, you can't sit and believe that we'd be content. Maybe the the few thousand dollars would only effect the basketball teams a little bit, but I can assure that non-revenue teams would feel that crunch a lot more. Our coaches put their best effort to get us what we want/need/etc, but if you laid us out w/ any other team in the MAAC, the gear we get looks like a high school team's, at best. Now granted, you'll probably go on a rant about records and what not, but please inform me how anyone can recruit well with issues like that, knowing that a high school kid is seeing these facilities on campus (the locker room which is essentially a cupboard that had the vent cover fall down on us), the fields that had 3+ ACL tears on it last year (thankfully we dodged that, poor MAAC teams though), and the gear given. I would rather go to a D2 school where they actually treat their athletes like just that, athletes. It's the same issue Rutgers ran into, how do you recruit against these teams and expect to be competitive when everything here is last and the administration has no interest in positively investing. A lot of athletes took the opportunity here because no one else would and the money was good to come into. Now, after being blessed with a coach who turned things around in her first year (look at the SPU WSOC GAA & the scorelines between this year and last), she may not be there next year as the plan to make women's and men's soccer FT was on the slate for July (of which was pushed by Boe). It just shows even more so a lack of involvement or actual want to move St. Peter's out of the hole that just seems to get deeper. So, finally answer after my rant, yeah, we're aware of conditions coming in, but the realization of how bad it actually is sets in once you're actually there. Also, please find a reason to excuse the fact that the athletes still have not been contacted and found out through a media release on ESPN, and not their school? Sure, claim personnel matter and say you're not speaking of it, but is it not common courtesy to inform the athletes who essentially are working under her? Even that bogus text could have been turned into an email blast, something would have been better than nothing. But there the school goes again, caring about anything that's not related to athletics and leaving them to clean the floors; hopefully one day SPU Athletics will get to experience the positive side of the Cinderella story.
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Post by oldtimer1 on Dec 23, 2016 9:23:45 GMT -5
spusoccerplayer good and heartfelt post. But please don't blame peacockpride as he, like all of us, wants the best for athletics and our teams. Hang in there and let's see what develops. And, by the way, you have a teriffic Coach.
pride...again it was I who originally posted the quote by Pat Elliott. Don't know if he ever got that direct access on a regular basis as he left. Regarding the original change in who the AD reports to, having Boe report directle Provost ( who was very good to us ) made her one step closer to the President. Now, and I agree with you that direct access to EC is primary the AD will now be two or more steps removed rather than one. So to me, it is a big deal if I read things correctly.
To be fair, obviously there is some access to the President, in any event. The question is really how much of an ear Athletics has and how is Athletics viewed at St. Peter's. Obviously the reality doesn't fit the rhetoric.
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Post by peacockpride on Dec 23, 2016 10:36:15 GMT -5
spusoccerplayer - I don't disagree with anything your saying. My original post was in response to another poster that wondered if Boe leaving would have a major impact on student-athletes looking to transfer. I don't believe it will. All of the things that you mention have nothing to do with Boe leaving- they were that way before she arrived, while she was here, and most likely will stay the same now that she's gone. If you read my posts in this thread, I am very upset and disappointed in the administration as well and your example of athletes not yet being informed is disgraceful. As for me "going on a rant about records," I have never discussed records of non-basketball sports in terms of evaluating performance and recruiting. You said yourself, "ask any kid at the school if they feel like D1 athletes, w/ exception to M&W Bball, the answer would be the same." Obviously you feel that basketball is treated like a D1 sport.
Where I disagree with some here is that I'm not sure that the administration doesn't want to invest in athletics. I agree that athletics is not a top priority, but at the same time with the lowest endowment in the conference by far, the lowest credit rating in the conference, and the college now operating in a deficit due to incompetence, it's not like there's bags of money sitting around that could be going towards athletics. If you look at the overall athletic operating budgets of each MAAC school, the ones at the top have the most money in their college budgets and I would say their investment in athletics is most likely proportional to SP in the percentage they spend out of the colleges overall budget.
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Post by spusoccerplayer on Dec 23, 2016 11:28:42 GMT -5
spusoccerplayer - I don't disagree with anything your saying. My original post was in response to another poster that wondered if Boe leaving would have a major impact on student-athletes looking to transfer. I don't believe it will. All of the things that you mention have nothing to do with Boe leaving- they were that way before she arrived, while she was here, and most likely will stay the same now that she's gone. If you read my posts in this thread, I am very upset and disappointed in the administration as well and your example of athletes not yet being informed is disgraceful. As for me "going on a rant about records," I have never discussed records of non-basketball sports in terms of evaluating performance and recruiting. You said yourself, "ask any kid at the school if they feel like D1 athletes, w/ exception to M&W Bball, the answer would be the same." Obviously you feel that basketball is treated like a D1 sport. Where I disagree with some here is that I'm not sure that the administration doesn't want to invest in athletics. I agree that athletics is not a top priority, but at the same time with the lowest endowment in the conference by far, the lowest credit rating in the conference, and the college now operating in a deficit due to incompetence, it's not like there's bags of money sitting around that could be going towards athletics. If you look at the overall athletic operating budgets of each MAAC school, the ones at the top have the most money in their college budgets and I would say their investment in athletics is most likely proportional to SP in the percentage they spend out of the colleges overall budget. @pride: I respectfully disagree with what you're saying about things not having to do with Boe leaving. As state previously in this thread, the administration wants a 'yes man', not someone who's trying to change things. The full time/part time thing has A LOT to do with Boe and when that reverts or they go back on what they're saying, how do you expect a good coach to want to come into this situation? You recruit coaches as much as you do with kids. There was a real sense of, 'wow, Boe might actually be able to help this place', even if it's after this class or a few more are gone. That was taken away from us. As for the 'rant' thing, I wasn't inferring that you would, I was saying that you could and it would be understandable, that got mixed with bad wording on my end. Incompetence is a big word that can be used to describe a lot of things at SPU so I agree with you there. I can see what you're saying, but the 'If I don't go to the games, they won't be there', mentality from them is disheartening. The "IHateBoe" account had a lot to say, complaining about Boe being on her phone & all, but at least she was there for us, and there for us A LOT. I don't recall her missing any of the soccer games; and so what if she's on her phone? The athletes aren't out there turning there head to see if Boe would see them making a big play...The fact that she was there was appreciated, the fact that we actually had someone trying to maintain the field was appreciated.. Again, I know you're not the one who posted that, but it does connect with the idea that administration really does pull the 'out of sight, out of mind' notion, while she was actually in the thick of things. And yes, as of this moment, we still have not been contacted. &@oldtimer, I don't mean to come off as blaming anyone, so that's my fault. The biggest issue from a student athlete's point of view (beyond Boe being gone), is the lack of respect that the athletes garner with administration. We do community service, more than less with a smile and no complaints, we bring in some All-MAAC Academic team members, a few All-MAAC athletes, we're doing the right things, and they still don't have the respect to send out a one or two lined email? That's not just a soccer issue, that shows the level of respect (or lack thereof) that they feel for us all across the board. It's something you see in a lot of NCAA athletics, and not just here, but man, with all of the deficits we do face, respect doesn't cost a dime. & also, we do have a fantastic coach and I can say confidently as a collective, we want her and the staff back. We came back this year with 14 returners of the same team and cut our GAA in half. That's incredible stat in soccer for a team that had been losing by 5+ goals a game just a year prior and had gone into late February without a coach. It shows that coaching has an incredible influence and that all started with Boe getting her here, so yes I'll defend Boe consistently. She was tough, but she truly had our best interest at heart and you could see it everyday. Until something comes out saying other wise, I won't see her any differently. Hoping for another great golf year btw!
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Post by oldtimer1 on Dec 23, 2016 11:46:29 GMT -5
Athletics is not a top priority. Money can be moved around. Just take a look at how the 7% plus cuts were allocated. Some things had priority, Athletics did not. But that's a debate for another day.
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