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Iona Game
Feb 3, 2016 6:33:17 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by loyal on Feb 3, 2016 6:33:17 GMT -5
Everyone is entitled to THEIR opinion.
Sorry, Boe! :-)
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Post by oldtimer1 on Feb 3, 2016 7:18:35 GMT -5
Loyal, I know and respect you and your opinion.It is always well stated. Right now JD's situation is a moot point until he comes close to the end of his contract. What I wanted peacockpride to read was about this guy Peacock and his history and tone of posting. If Peacock would have just stuck to the argument that you and others have presented I would have no problem. However, he interjects personal stuff and put downs since when I first joined this Board. I do not start "fights" but when I or others are spoken about in his condescending superior style I will respond as I did.
peacockpride and others are good posters who also show an excellent knowledge of the game. My only response was that his characterization and or guess that I was against evaluating a Coach by his record was incorrect. I've posted many a time over the years that I agree totally and have posted so. Peacockpride wasn't posting and probably never read my take on the subject and so misquoted my position. That said, I have my own opinion on evaluating JD but as I said above it's a moot point, at this stage. NO ONE knows if someone else could have done a better job than JD over his tenure so speculating on that is just that,idle speculation. That said if the powers that be, and will not just be Boe's call ( trust me) conclude that it's time for a change that I'll be fine with that. Sometimes change is good.
Boe has been very good to me and I respect her. She's working very hard. As for me, I was planning on retiring as of Jan 31st but my extremely competitent Assistant was offered and took a full time job elsewhere at a D 3 school in PA. Good for him, he was my first Captain and this move is in his best interest. Although I have other things to do with my life, Boe convinced me to stay. I accepted because I love my players and have 3 excellent recruits coming in. So who knows what the future holds. And, by the way, thanks for your support for our Golf team.
To sum it up, there is plenty of room on this Board for differences of opinion. That was not the issue which prompted my retort. Can't stand, and never could, the veiled put down style that Peacock uses. His opinion was never the issue...he was and is the issue. Someone that I just don't respect.
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Post by peacockpride on Feb 3, 2016 8:20:22 GMT -5
Oldtimer, fair enough take. My only point in regards to Peacock was I thought that in between the personal stuff was an interesting debate, regardless of his motives.
I do not disagree that JD is a tremendous coach and as I mentioned I have no doubt he would be hired by someone in a second if he was let go. I wouldn't go as far as saying he is the best coach in the area because I don't think that can be said with his record. There are examples of coaches that do well with limited resources and facility. Mihalich, who loyal mentioned, comes to mind as I can't imagine Niagara being a more attrative destination than SP.
I agree that Coyle is doing a good job despite her record. I do wonder how and why she ended up at SP with her background because it doesn't seem to add up. However, while not an everyday follower of the women's program, it seems they were in much worse shape than when JD took over the men's team. If she is only winning 10-15 games per year in 8 years then I would change my opinion.
Loyal, as to your point about JD not moving up like some coaches, I think he is in a very unique spot. I believe I read he was a finalist for Monmouth and Fairfield jobs after the MAAC Championship season. He could have got a job then based on his overall record at the time because his teams trended upward and culminated with an NCAA trip. Now 5 years later, the 2011 season looks like the outlier after being followed by two single digit win seasons and no other winning teams. So what school is willing to take a coach with a 38% record and explain that to their donors and alums, who play more of a factor most places than at SP? "His record is so poor because he doesn't have resources but trust us he's great coach" isn't a risk many ADs would take and may not be logic that many donors would buy into. IMO, JDs only move could be a lateral move to a MAAC or NEC type school, and why would he make that move when up to this point he has a very stable job at SP? (Reviving a two year extension after four losing seasons is a pretty secure job!) Even after the MAAC championship win, moving to Fairfield or Monmouth would have resulted in a raise but not necessarily a "promotion" because it would not be moving to a bigger level. Probably would've needed at least three good years at those places before moving to the next level. So in a sense, he is "stuck" at SP because he can't move up on his own at this point and SP has shown they will continue to extend him despite his record. A very unique and uncommon situation for a D1 basketball program.
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Post by oldtimer1 on Feb 3, 2016 10:57:55 GMT -5
peacockpride...thanks. I do enjoy your posts as it's obvious that you do know what you are talking about. We may disagree on minor things but that's the fun of this Board. That said I'm sort of handicapped, at times, by having some inside information and the fact that as a Coach, on staff, I do not want to overly critize players. I root for them although I understand some of their deficiencies.
Regarding JD, it's not even time to discuss the future. Although I like the guy and have great respect for his coaching ability, as I stated sometimes a change is called for, even just for the idea of change itself. My hope is that he puts together a good season or two so that talk about him being let go becomes irrelevant.
Just a thought for everyone to consider. Take a look at the records of all our 19 sports teams. Not only not very good but horrible. I know some the Coach's and many are very good...so why are we dead last in the MAAC Comissioner's Cup? Has to be reasons way aside from the Coach's. As for me, I'm the exception not really because I'm that good but that I bring certain advantages...enough said.
Keep posting your opinion...I like it. Just realize that I have some boundaries in what I choose to post. Self imposed boundaries.
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Post by peacockpride on Feb 3, 2016 11:36:50 GMT -5
Oldtimer, you are right about the Commisioners Cup and that it points to the overall ineptitude of the department. However, I believe that many of the "minor" sports face disadvantages that basketball does not deal with. Basketball has full time coaches and the same amount of scholarships as everyone else so that is one of the major issues with the other sports. Yes the coaching salary is low but most assistant basketball coaches would still take a d1 coaching opportunity as a head coach since the jobs are so few. We would not have the "pick of the litter" but a search would produce some viable candidates I'm sure. Also (correct me if I'm wrong) but a lot of the new advantages that have been passed by the NCAA that you referenced, such as paying actual cost of attendance, are voted on by the conferences so while SP does not provide those, neither does the rest of the MAAC. I cannot imagine assistant basketball coaches are paid that well at SP, as Guild leaving for the same position at Rider would lead me to believe, but at least they are full time.
Looking through the coaching directory and bios, many of the head coaches not only do not have d1 coaching experience but have no college coaching experience altogether (and reading your bio I believe you were in this category as well unless I'm mistaken). That is a huge disadvantage that basketball does not face. Selling recruits in general, no less at SP, is not something that should be learned on the job as a head coach. Also, with coaching salaries so low (I was told some years ago that most head coaches made less than $10k, although not sure if that has gone up in the years since) I can only imagine what assistant coaches get paid for those sports. You mentioned your own assistant just left for a d3 job. Assuming he would have been in the mix for your job if we're retiring, that speaks a lot about the state of SP athletics if a coach turns down a D1 job opportunity to go to a D3 school. Same with the old soccer coach who chose to leave SP after a successful career with no other job opportunity because he could not get a raise. As an outsider, this to me seems like the major disadvantage for a lot of the other sports. Good coaches, as you and some others have shown, can overcome a lot of the disadvantages, but I can't imagine many qualified candidates going to work for $10k and if they do, I can only imagine the lack of time they are able to put into their programs while trying to make a living elsewhere.
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Post by oldtimer1 on Feb 3, 2016 16:47:37 GMT -5
peacockpride...pretty good analysis.
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