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Post by oldtimer1 on Feb 5, 2016 10:52:36 GMT -5
peacockpride... you are right! In my first post I said nothing about my feelings on Du's return and in a second post commented that I would love to see his return.That was intended to be a general comment not on the immediate future. Probably poorly worded because I have no "expert" opinion on the subject and no real opinion although it seems that others such as yourself could write chapter on verse on that.
If I appear condescending that's your opinion. It seems that most on this board, as knowledgeable as they think they are, post unendingly about what is wrong with this team and Coach. I have almost always taken the position of making no such posts. If I comment, and it seems condescending to you, it's probably because of these so called experts who think they know everything about everything. In reading your posts it obvious to me that you have contacts and some inside information. If so, I congratulate you on being selective on what you post
Your first paragraph is so far off base that it would take a book to retort. If you read my posts going back to my first favorite player Nick Leon I've always taken the stance that no one, except for staff knows, including me , everything about everything. I rarely give inside information and do not dwell on it. When I do it's to help some fans get information. Not a scource of pride but just trying to help.
Rather than use "condescending" I'd rather be characterized by being a little "pissed off" by some of the junk I read from some posters. You obviously have a basketball background as I believe so does eport and perhaps some others.Figgy, for example, IMO has great basketball knowledge. I also have one also so I am prone to get upset when I here some of this other stuff.
Regarding you second paragraph, I do not need to be lectured on the rules of redshirting medical or otherwise. I am a Coach and know all the rules. Did not want to get into the minuta of why Chazz's redshirt would have been different from that of Du. No need to show expertise as you seem to need to do. The simple point was "redshhirt" or not...just general terms. My point simply was that the player told me that he would was not being redshirted. Never even, or would I speak, to JD about that. None of my business. Might not even be true since the only scource was the player. But once I posted that then the commentary and so-called expert opinions start. That bothers me. I could make a good case for Du coming back and seeing limited minutes at Seasons end or I could easily argure as you and loyal for him not to. I could care less. I'd prefer to leave it up to the Coach and player. That's my condescending attitude.
Finally, you've thrown around a lot of names in your post. I've given partial background on my so called "expertise". Relucant to say more but I did play HS basketball on a pretty good team and D1 freshman basketball ( non scholarship walk on, not at SP ) on an eventual pretty good college team ( NIT) but never made Varsity. So I guess you could call me pretty mediocre. But that is still a basketball background. For full disclosure I'd like to know who you are as I am an open book.Who are you, as much as you care to reveal, and what is your background. Really like most of your posts. Obviously shows knowledge but sometimes goes way overboard. I do not view you as condescending but often read your posts as too much "want to be a coach posting".
Have a Golf Team to prepare with this Spring so my frustration with Boards in general might prompt me to retire from this Board. While sometimes fun stuff and I've met a lot of friends through this board. Yet a lot of it frustrates me and if that seems condscending so be it. Too much "paralysis by analysis".
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Post by cindycrawford on Feb 5, 2016 11:44:09 GMT -5
One thing is certain beyond all the speculation , and Rumsfeld and OT would call it the known unknown, the possibility of Du's medical redshirt. Heading up early now to Albany . I suspect the thruway will be Ok . Returning tomorrow for Hall of Fame dinner to honor '68 Peacocks and our own beloved OT. Hope to see some of you there .
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Post by loyal on Feb 5, 2016 11:47:57 GMT -5
"Beloved" might be overstating things a tad....
:-)
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Post by cindycrawford on Feb 5, 2016 12:11:19 GMT -5
That's harsh. As he has oft said ,let us agree to disagree,but let the man, and us, basque in the glow of his accomplishments as golf coach and his loyalty to SP.
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Post by oldtimer1 on Feb 5, 2016 12:32:17 GMT -5
Thanks Cindy and we both love Loyal and as you know he spoke tongue in cheek. To Loyal, I have more detractors on this board ( 2/3) than anyone else in my entire life. But that's OK because I bring it on myself for having no patience or respect for some. FYI, peacockpride is OK in my book, just tried to give him back a little of what he gave me.
As far as beloved, I do know that my players, past and present, feel that way about me. I'm very pround of the team chemistry we forged over the years. Many weddings to attend!
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Post by peacockpride on Feb 5, 2016 13:30:41 GMT -5
If I appear condescending that's your opinion. It seems that most on this board, as knowledgeable as they think they are, post unendingly about what is wrong with this team and Coach. I have almost always taken the position of making no such posts. If I comment, and it seems condescending to you, it's probably because of these so called experts who think they know everything about everything. In reading your posts it obvious to me that you have contacts and some inside information. If so, I congratulate you on being selective on what you post Your first paragraph is so far off base that it would take a book to retort. If you read my posts going back to my first favorite player Nick Leon I've always taken the stance that no one, except for staff knows, including me , everything about everything. I rarely give inside information and do not dwell on it. When I do it's to help some fans get information. Not a scource of pride but just trying to help. Rather than use "condescending" I'd rather be characterized by being a little "pissed off" by some of the junk I read from some posters. You obviously have a basketball background as I believe so does eport and perhaps some others.Figgy, for example, IMO has great basketball knowledge. I also have one also so I am prone to get upset when I here some of this other stuff. Oldtimer, no one knows everything about everything but as I mentioned you seem to be reluctant to admit that someone knows something better than you. A perfect example is your most recent exchange on the MAAC boarda few weeks ago. You posted that SP was in "much better financial shape than some other MAAC schools" and they have money put just don't put it into Athletics. A few other posters called you out on being far from the truth. When one poster listed the facts from the most recent SP tax filing that showed the school is in worse shape than every other MAAC school, instead of admitting you were wrong, your response was that unless he was the COO of the school and had insider information he couldn't know the whole story! Forbes gave SP a grade of D in their most recent report on financial stability but because the facts don't support your original statement you give the response that "no one knows for sure." When you use Chazz as an example in comparison to Du's situation, it is not me stating the "minutia" and showing my "knowledge" of the rules, it's simply pointing out that they are two completely different scenarios which you tried to position as one in the same. But as you feel the need to remind us, you touted Nick Leon so what can any of the rest of us possibly know...
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Post by newfan on Feb 5, 2016 15:37:46 GMT -5
Well tonight ESPNU it is. Hope our guys can pull together and get this win. We all know the home cooking up there in what is probably the most hostile gym we play in. And the 7 against 5, including the whistle against us, sure the whistles have our guys names on it. we got no love up there. Out guys have shown resiliency and fight. They will need all that tonight ROOTING HARD TONIGHT AS ALWAYS LETS GO PEACOCKS
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Post by oldtimer1 on Feb 5, 2016 15:52:04 GMT -5
peacockpride... you "perfect example" again is not so perfect. So let's correct your post. Several weeks ago on the MAAC Board one well know idiot poster said that Saint Peter's and, I believe Rider were in danger of closing or, at least, in very serious trouble. I replied that this was not so as our attendace has been hitting all time highs and so much better than only a few years ago. Yes, a few years ago things did not look good but since then things have taken a big step forward. Are you not aware of this? Then another poster tried to jump in with some published statistics, very incomplete that he thought countered my assertion. I accepted his stats but added that they in no way changed the improving picture of SP finances. Rather than getting into a back and forth and time spent elaborating on the total picture I stated that his stats were not telling the complete picture and that the school was getting much stronger than weaker, I ended by telling the truth, that neither he nor I (nor you) were not the COO or CFO and thus were not privy to inside information for analysis. You object to that response or do you know better? Was I "far from the truth" or do you have information to support that statement. Please tell us...how stupid!
Now on to your coments on Chazz and Du. Do you think I did not know that their situations were different. I am a Coach and am familiar with the considerations on redshirting both from a Compliance and NCAA perspective. My reference to both of them in terms of redshirting was the bottom line of saving eligibility. And, yes, even there, there are differences. But no, you had to go into a lecture on different types of redshirting. For what purpose? Then you went on, as you always do, to give your take as to when Du should play, this year or next. And you have absolutely no knowledge of the situation. Again, how stupid! I posted that I could argue either way but that it was best to leave it up to the doctors, player and coach. You were rendering an opinion way before the fact and really none of your business. So who thinks that they no more than everybody...you or I? Read your own posts they are full of that type of stuff. Yes, it's a message board and that type of posting makes it fun but it's you, not me , who offers opinion after opinion. Sort of the pot calling the kettle black.
Finally, I asked you to tell us a little more about you background> It would help me understand your posting better. You seem to have a ton of opinions. Even that's OK as I posted to Loyal...it's a message board. As for me, if I take the road of one of our better and former posters John Galt to cut back or eliminate my postings please don't take it for a sign of weakness. Just need to get away from these back and forths...too much time and energy. Good luck in your postings but give some personal information background. I'll leave the last reply to you.
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Post by peacockpride on Feb 5, 2016 16:44:17 GMT -5
Here is the post I was referring to from jomo on the MAAC board detailing SP's most recent reporting and where the school stands in the MAAC for any posters here that are interested:
"total assets $133M this is by far the lowest total in the maac. Next lowest is Iona at $233M. They are $100M behind Iona, over $200M behind Monmouth and $440M behind Marist. And Marist is only 3rd.
total revenue (net of tuition discounts): $72M Again, dead last. Niagara is almost as bad, but everyone else is at least $25M ahead.
Long term debt: $60M debt to revenue and debt to equity ratios are far, far behind all other maac schools.
Net Assets: $35M next lowest is Rider, $132M. "
Thankfully for SP (according to Oldtimer) none of us are insiders or the COO so we can't possibly have any sort of understanding about what these numbers mean or be privy to the insider analysis needed to interpret them. They obviously don't tell the whole story because, as all the SP insiders would know, there's $200M tucked away in a safe under Cornachia's bed for a rainy day that SP doesn't report on their taxes. In seriousness, if you disagree, please tell specifically what is missing that makes these numbers incomplete, as you claim?
Of course the poster who said that Rider and SP were in financial trouble because they received the lowest grade possible for financial stability without actually closing, he must be a "well known idiot poster" because his opinion goes against that of Oldtimer.
As for your question on my purpose of posting the difference between Chazz and Du, you talked in your original post about the players making the decision to want to redshirt and how that may factor in to the situation. When a player has a season ending injury there is very little input from the player on what they want to do, which is why bringing up Chazz's situation was misleading because it is completely different. I don't think I know more than anybody, just stating the facts.
Oldtimer, I mentioned my background to you previously. Graduated from SP in the late 1990's and have followed the program since I arrived as a student. I have several friends/acquaintances still working at SP but not as many as I used to compared to 5-10 years ago. I don't have the high school basketball playing experience or coaching experience from a rec league so I apologize that I am not on your level of expertise. Not a "want to be coach" like you say, just someone who enjoys discussing basketball and SP like everyone else on this message board since that's what its here for.
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Post by oldtimer1 on Feb 5, 2016 18:02:41 GMT -5
peacockpride...said I wouldn't reply but you were getting too nasty. So, when you were a student did you believe everything that you read? There's an old saying..."statistics don't lie but liars use statistics" I'm not disputing the figures quoted above but they are definitely extremely incomplete and misleading. The turnaround at St. Peter's over the last few years has been quite dramatic. And this takes place at a time when many private colleges are facing enrollment declines and other difficulties. Do some reading on this.
When you were a student did you have others write your papers for you? If you have a serious interest in commenting further then YOU do the research. Don't ask me to do your work.I'm happy with what I know on the subject.. Moreover, you do sound a little bitter with your Cornachia's reference, attempting to be funny or not. If you know or knew anything about the MAAC Board,you would know that it's a trash board, always has been.That's a well known fact, Has nothing to do with me. And yes most are "idiots".. I stay away, as do others. Probably made four posts in the last few years and only when they are trashing my school. Doesn't the comment that our school along with Rider will be the next to close upset you?
Finally, I do congratulate you on divulging some of you background. No one needs a significant basketball background to post. We have some very basketball wise posters.
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Post by loyal on Feb 5, 2016 18:17:44 GMT -5
Sounds like the good news is the arrow is pointing up re: enrollment and revenue. Still appears there is long way to go.
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Post by peacockpride on Feb 5, 2016 19:00:22 GMT -5
Oldtimer, I don't believe everything that I do read but I don't think the school falsified their tax reporting, which would be the case if these stats weren't accurate. You keep saying these numbers are extremely incomplete and misleading but can't seem to state something specific that is missing from them other than your opinion that the school is doing well and in your words "better than some other MAAC schools." Not asking you to do research, but just give one example as a basis for your argument. No one ever said the school wasn't doing better or improving, but it is far from doing well. The fact that there have been drastic improvements does not change that there is still a long way to go to even reach the bottom of the pack in terms both athletics and the college as a whole. Yes, most private schools are facing enrollment declines, but Saint Peter's had declined so much that it had no place to go but up...or fold. Look at the academic profiles of the incoming students and the retention/graduation numbers. Enrollment is up but pretty much no standards for being admitted. As loyal says, at least the arrow is pointing up, but your comment that the school has money and isn't giving it to athletics is just false.
The comment that SP along with Rider will be the next to close does bother me...because there is some merit to it, not because of the person who posted it. That was in response to the Forbes article in which Rider and SP were the only MAAC school to have received below a C for financial stability. I did do my own papers when I was a student and I known D is not a good grade. Having an endowment of only $35M is not healthy, especially for a school that needs the improvements that SP does.
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Post by cindycrawford on Feb 5, 2016 19:19:24 GMT -5
Is this still a basketball board ? If discussions on politics are verboten extended harping on economics is becoming a bore. Perhaps our beloved administrator could set up satellite sites where those inclined could occupy their time with politics, economics and various topics such as fly fishing and emu farming .
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Post by oldtimer1 on Feb 5, 2016 20:20:29 GMT -5
Cindy is right.Time to move on. However, atleast we got you now to admit that the school is doing much better than just a few years ago. That was always my main point...thank you. FYI I do know many things that you are not aware of but have no intention of needing to prove something to you. You talk as much in generalizations as you claim that I do. Such as "St. Peter's has declined so much that it has no where to go but up... or fold." Guess we didn't...fold that is. Where is the same proof that you are asking of me? All you do is spout the same generalities that you accuse me of with much less information.
My original point on the MAAC Board was to rebut that the school was in imminent danger of closing. Never implied, on the other hand, that the school was awash with money as you state. And FYI academic standards have tightened and entrance requirements/standards have risen. Know this as it was addressed at a Coach's meeting by the head of Admissions. You also should have known that Athletics was always a poor stepchid. For you to imply otherwise tells me that you know basically nothing. Need proof? Now with Boe coming in, Athletics has been assured of much more financial support. She had a personal meeting with the Chairman of the Board of Trustees last week who assured her of that. Good news which you were not privy to. Boe has already hired an Assistant at a decent salary, something we never had before. Team budgets are going to be improved next year and we have been approved to turn one part-time coach into a full time one.Sound like a declining school? All this takes money. Been to a game? Did you notice the new gym lighting which was quite expensive. Money is finally moving into Athletics and it didn't come from heaven. So tell me how poor we are doing and tell me if you knew any of the above that I just posted. Of course not!
Cindy is right, enough of this stuff. While I don't know everything and, quite frankly,try to stay away from all of this internal stuff I do know infinitely more than you do and have no intention of informing you of things that you know nothing about. That's how far off base your latest post was.
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Post by oldtimer1 on Feb 5, 2016 20:24:49 GMT -5
Cindy, I apologize. Please start a new threat focusing on tonights game. Looking forward to you eyewitness take.
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